Politics

LioninVa
Posts: 674
Joined: Tue Aug 15, 2017 11:49 am

Re: Politics

Postby LioninVa » Tue Jul 17, 2018 12:16 pm

He should have called Putin out on it rather that suck up to him. How is that difficult to understand? Sure, it would be a veiled threat, but he would have sided with his own country and its law enforcement rather tha. Throw them all under the bus.

Blue&White
Posts: 2600
Joined: Sat Aug 12, 2017 10:01 am

Re: Politics

Postby Blue&White » Tue Jul 17, 2018 12:29 pm

What specifically do you want him to do?

I am not a cyber security expert so forgive me for struggling to give a precise answer to that question. but, off the top of my head, I'd like him to:
- listen to the experts and dedicate some money to safeguard our election process
- maybe make this a national priority and get some kind of taskforce
- support the Justice Department in their efforts to investigate and prosecute crimes around this
- and, maybe, perhaps, when you are with the leader of the country who did this as part of an organized effort to disrupt our election process, not take his f-ing side on the matter, throw your own intelligence services under the bus in an international press conference, and effectively give a wink and a nod that it's ok if he does it again because you have no intention of taking any action to stop him or punish him.
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psu_dad
Posts: 1577
Joined: Sun Aug 13, 2017 6:59 pm

Re: Politics

Postby psu_dad » Tue Jul 17, 2018 1:09 pm

I was also going to suggest he start a "task force" but I was being sarcastic and decided not to. Task forces rock. I'm available, BTW, at my normal contract rate. :lol:

And if Trump thwarts the Justice Department in their efforts to investigate and prosecute crimes around this, I'm confident he will be impeached. He can't take a dump without someone leaking it to the WaPo. So there's no way he's going to get away with that.

If the "election interference" is primarily an email hacking problem, that's easy. Don't f---ing send anything via email that would embarrass you if it became public. Or (at the very least) use encryption. I've been following that approach since email was invented. I use email because it's fast, not because no one else could possibly ever see it. Jeezus H. Krist. How do people think email gets from point A to point B? Do they think it's beamed there instantly like on Star Trek? If some kid in Toledo is hacking you and he gets caught, the FBI and Justice Department will drop a house on him. If it's some guy in Minsk or Pinsk, it's tough noogies for you.

If the election interference involved something other than garden variety hacking, then it's hard to demand "something be done" without details.
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Blue&White
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Re: Politics

Postby Blue&White » Tue Jul 17, 2018 1:46 pm

So, because people used email when they shouldn't it's ok if they get hacked? Is it ok to mug someone if they walk into the wrong neighborhood? How about if they leave their car unlocked and you steal it. If the car is unlocked, is it still a crime? I do not follow your logic here at all. That the DNC doesn't have clean hands doesn't make hacking them ok. Your willingness to put the blame everywhere but where it belongs is astonishing.

As for Trump interfering, he is undermining the investigation into this every single day. His attacks on the FBI and DOJ are right out in the open. Whether or not it reaches the level of high crimes or misdemeanors is subjective but he is doing his best to obstruct this investigation every single day.

Finally, the Russians did more than just hack the DNC. They have done far more than that to try to influence the election and impact public policy and perception. We could never list all the actions they have taken but here is one example.
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psu_dad
Posts: 1577
Joined: Sun Aug 13, 2017 6:59 pm

Re: Politics

Postby psu_dad » Tue Jul 17, 2018 2:14 pm

I do not follow your logic here at all.

No, apparently not. The logic is not that hacking email is OK. The logic is that assuming that un-encrypted email is inviolate is foolish. Is stealing an unlocked car with the keys left behind wrong? Of course. Is the car owner foolish? Absolutely.

The task force recommendation to the DNC would be simple: This was preventable. Get your heads out of your ass.

The other example you cited is not so simple. People who are easily influenced by crap on the internet will always be vulnerable because crap on the internet is not going away, even if you create 1000 task forces. Foreign crap. Domestic crap. Maybe even alien crap, who knows.

--------------------

PS - None of that should be construed as anti task force. I'm totally up for that. I'm even tweaking my CV.
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PSUgrower
Posts: 712
Joined: Thu Aug 17, 2017 10:52 am

Re: Politics

Postby PSUgrower » Tue Jul 17, 2018 2:26 pm

Blue&White wrote:Finally, the Russians did more than just hack the DNC. They have done far more than that to try to influence the election and impact public policy and perception. We could never list all the actions they have taken but here is one example.

I read about this last year. The Russians didn't just leak emails. They created thousands of Facebook accounts and fed America complete lies. I have a good amount of Facebook friends and a few family members who truly thought all of the articles were true. Great article about Facebook and their persuasion powers: https://www.theatlantic.com/technology/archive/2017/10/what-facebook-did/542502/

Blue&White
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Re: Politics

Postby Blue&White » Tue Jul 17, 2018 2:49 pm

I wasn't suggesting a task force to stop people from being stupid or doing stupid things. A push to better educate people is a lost cause. People are hardwired to believe what they want to believe and reject contrary evidence. We are all guilty of looking harder at our biases and ignoring things that contradict our preconceived notions. We are natural hypocrites. It takes a lot of effort to not only get unbiases information but to look at information with a critical unbiased view. No matter how much someone may tried to challenge their own preconceptions, we are all guilty of bias. It's the human condition. And, most people are not trying too hard. I know a lot of seemingly intelligent peple who grab on to obvious bullshit because it was put out by "their" side. So, given that, any effort to get people to do more critical thinking is DOA. It's not going to happen.

What I was thinking in terms of a task force is a criminal task force. More effort into preventing bullshit getting spread and hacking from happening. Investments into cyber security, safeguarding personal information, and maybe bring some of our laws into the 21st century so when you do catch someone who is guilty of malfeasance you have the means to prosecute them. I don't favor laws that would stop people from spewing bullshit - it's still a free country (ostensibly) and that includes freedom of speech - but the kind of targetting we saw during the election becuase of grabbing people's personal data? That should be illegal and punishable. That's what I am talking about.

And, you can be sure that none of that will happen. Becuase F*ckface vonClownstick can't admit anything may have happened because he sees it as some kind of attack on him.
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psu_dad
Posts: 1577
Joined: Sun Aug 13, 2017 6:59 pm

Re: Politics

Postby psu_dad » Tue Jul 17, 2018 3:32 pm

Becuase F*ckface vonClownstick can't admit anything may have happened because he sees it as some kind of attack on him.

In large part, it is. It would be nice if the MSM and others who loathe the POTUS would have treated this "election interference" issue as simply a security problem that needed to be solved. But they have absolutely/positively politicized it. They have treated it as an opportunity to invalidate his election, if not flat-out insisting he was an accomplice.

So he's not totally paranoid. He IS being attacked. And he's not handling it adroitly. He's not equipped for that, either in temperament or by his life-long occupation of telling people what to do and expecting them to f---ing do it or else.

I know a lot of seemingly intelligent peple who grab on to obvious bullshit because it was put out by "their" side

The advantage of being a libertarian is that you don't have a side. The disadvantage is that you can't have a protest march with signs and chants and cookies and stuff. A libertarian march would look like a few guys going out to grab some lunch.
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Blue&White
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Re: Politics

Postby Blue&White » Tue Jul 17, 2018 3:44 pm

And that is the problem. And, it is a big one. And it is the reason he is refusing to put his weight behind doing anything about it. How does he not see how bad this looks?

Btw, he is taking heat on all ends over this. Apparently even Fox and Friends called him out. Ouch.

He just gave a PC. I didn't have time to watch it but here is a good 30 second overview of what he had to say.
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LioninVa
Posts: 674
Joined: Tue Aug 15, 2017 11:49 am

Re: Politics

Postby LioninVa » Tue Jul 17, 2018 4:08 pm

Well played, B-Dub! That’s a classic scene...

What he did say was that he mis-spoke and meant to say he saw no reason to believe the Russians didn’t do it. Which, of course, is supported by his reasoning that Trump strongly denied it and his lack of concern during the Hannity verbal fellatio hour. (not that I watched it)