Politics

Blue&White
Posts: 3199
Joined: Sat Aug 12, 2017 10:01 am

Re: Politics

Postby Blue&White » Tue Jan 08, 2019 10:36 am

He is pulling out troops in the middle east and doesn't realize the chaos that is about to ensue! Dump does not think ahead at all. Weakening ties in middle east will lead to more terrorism and I hope it doesn't come to America's doorstep (even though homegrown terrorists are a bigger issue at the moment).

I am not sure how Syria can get more chaotic than it currently is. The reasl "risk", such as it is, is that someone other than the US will have influence on what goes on next and how any future government is handled. And, in all honesty, I'm perfectly ok with that. I'm tired of the US being the world's policeman. I agree with Trump on this one: declare victory and get the heck out of there. Why are the lives of American military personal being hurt, killed and generally put at risk over Syria? I am all for helping out displaced people and refugees but that is a different proposition than us imposing our will through a military intervention. Same with Iraq. The Iraqis want us out. We should honor their wishes and get out. They are a sovereign, independent nation. If they don't want us there, we have no business, or right, to be there.

As for the idea that pulling out will lead to terrorists on our doorstep, I think that's nonesense. First, they know we are here already. They don't need to follow us. They have maps and can find us just fine. Second, us being in the middle east in the first place is what sets them off. Pull out, mind your own damn business, and the loons of the world will be less interested in attacking us. Violence begets violence and the US is ultra violent. We are constantly dropping missiles from drones on people, many of which are completely innocent. We have killed thousands of people over the past 10 or so years. We've bombed mosques where people were worshiping, weddings, funerals, etc. And then we complain about terrorism. It's an insane juxtaposition. I am all for a policy that puts an end to it.
Is it baseball season yet?

PSUgrower
Posts: 862
Joined: Thu Aug 17, 2017 10:52 am

Re: Politics

Postby PSUgrower » Tue Jan 08, 2019 12:40 pm

Blue&White wrote:I am not sure how Syria can get more chaotic than it currently is. The reasl "risk", such as it is, is that someone other than the US will have influence on what goes on next and how any future government is handled. And, in all honesty, I'm perfectly ok with that. I'm tired of the US being the world's policeman. I agree with Trump on this one: declare victory and get the heck out of there. Why are the lives of American military personal being hurt, killed and generally put at risk over Syria? I am all for helping out displaced people and refugees but that is a different proposition than us imposing our will through a military intervention. Same with Iraq. The Iraqis want us out. We should honor their wishes and get out. They are a sovereign, independent nation. If they don't want us there, we have no business, or right, to be there.

To me, it is the way he goes about everything that really irks me. BTW, we didn't defeat ISIS. I am sure the Kurds might disagree with you on us being there

I always use this analogy in my classroom: I tell a kid nicely and politely to please turn off the lights. They do it because I ask nicely and want to please. Next, I yell at the kid to turn off the lights. They turn off the lights but in the back of their minds they are cursing me out. Part of Dumps charm to some of his constituents is his douchebag attitude. That is the part I hate about him. He continues to be jock in the locker room talking about his conquests. I was hoping that would change after a few years in office.

Blue&White
Posts: 3199
Joined: Sat Aug 12, 2017 10:01 am

Re: Politics

Postby Blue&White » Tue Jan 08, 2019 12:56 pm

I think he's a douchebag, too. But, ultimately, what matters is his policy decisions. I am firmly against much of what he stands for and does. Much of it, but not all of it.

Managing foreign policy via your twitter account is moronic. And, belittling your allies is probably not a smart thing to do. But, that doesn't mean he's wrong about pulling us out of Syria. Even if he's right for the wrong reason - who cares?

The reality is that, in a lot of ways, he's not vastly different than many of his predecessors. The real difference is that most presidents have the decency to pretend they aren't obnoxious sociopaths when they are in front of the public. Trump wears being an obnoxiou sociopath as a badge of honor. It's a style, and I think it's pretty self-defeating because the press and his political adveraries focus on that. And then he complains the coverage of him isn't "fair" (whatever "fair" means). But, he also does it to distract you from what else he is doing. "Pay no attention to the man behind the curtain" is the game that is being played here. For all the talk about how crazy he is, I often think he's the smartest one in the room. I think he is far more aware of what he's doing and the impact his words and actions are having than he is ever given credit for.

Unfortunately, I do think he is very uninformed and often doesn't know what he's talking about. But, all that does is make him a less endearing George W. Bush. Oh, there is one other difference between him and W.: George W. Bush is a war criminal who lied us into an illegal invasion of Iraq and is has the blood of thousands of US servicemen and hundreds of thousdands of Iraqi civilians on his hands. But, hey, at least he wasn't consistently obnoxious.

I keep hearing how he's the worst president in our history. I don't think he's even the worst president in my kids' lifetime, to be honest.
Is it baseball season yet?

LioninVa
Posts: 744
Joined: Tue Aug 15, 2017 11:49 am

Re: Politics

Postby LioninVa » Tue Jan 08, 2019 2:57 pm

I anticipate that he will make his case with the same lies as before and possibly declare a national emergency. If he doesn’t declare it tonight, he will get pressure from Sean, Rush and the gang and declare it in a few days. That’s my best guess.

If he stays on prompter, he might have a decently delivered address (aside from the deception, of course). I am curious to see if he goes off on tangents. I assume the MSM is hoping this is the case.

Crowbar
Posts: 862
Joined: Sun Aug 27, 2017 12:54 pm

Re: Politics

Postby Crowbar » Tue Jan 08, 2019 7:56 pm

Blue&White wrote:I think he's a douchebag, too. But, ultimately, what matters is his policy decisions. I am firmly against much of what he stands for and does. Much of it, but not all of it.

Managing foreign policy via your twitter account is moronic. And, belittling your allies is probably not a smart thing to do. But, that doesn't mean he's wrong about pulling us out of Syria. Even if he's right for the wrong reason - who cares?

The reality is that, in a lot of ways, he's not vastly different than many of his predecessors. The real difference is that most presidents have the decency to pretend they aren't obnoxious sociopaths when they are in front of the public. Trump wears being an obnoxiou sociopath as a badge of honor. It's a style, and I think it's pretty self-defeating because the press and his political adveraries focus on that. And then he complains the coverage of him isn't "fair" (whatever "fair" means). But, he also does it to distract you from what else he is doing. "Pay no attention to the man behind the curtain" is the game that is being played here. For all the talk about how crazy he is, I often think he's the smartest one in the room. I think he is far more aware of what he's doing and the impact his words and actions are having than he is ever given credit for.

Unfortunately, I do think he is very uninformed and often doesn't know what he's talking about. But, all that does is make him a less endearing George W. Bush. Oh, there is one other difference between him and W.: George W. Bush is a war criminal who lied us into an illegal invasion of Iraq and is has the blood of thousands of US servicemen and hundreds of thousdands of Iraqi civilians on his hands. But, hey, at least he wasn't consistently obnoxious.

I keep hearing how he's the worst president in our history. I don't think he's even the worst president in my kids' lifetime, to be honest.


I get where you're coming from and I too am amazed how people have glossed over Bush 43's legacy since DJT took office as if this idiotic wall is worse than the Iraq war.

I am torn on the Syria issue. On one hand my thinking is if the Russians want to break Syria, let them fix it. On the other hand, the Iraq invasion inadvertently created ISIS. Since ISIS is a uniquely American problem we should be the ones to deal with the bastards.
National Champions 1911, 1912, 1969, 1981, 1982, 1986, 1994

Blue&White
Posts: 3199
Joined: Sat Aug 12, 2017 10:01 am

Re: Politics

Postby Blue&White » Wed Jan 09, 2019 7:10 am

I'm not sure why ISIS is a uniquely American problem. Yes, it's true we basically created them (another "win" for George W. Bush) but they are operating in other countries. And, those countries do not want us there anymore. Occupying a foreign country and telling them it's for their own good is the type of thinking that creates terrorists intent on coming here and killing innocent people.

We seriously messed up when we invaded Iraq but continuing the occupation isn't helping. Get us out of there.
Is it baseball season yet?

PSUgrower
Posts: 862
Joined: Thu Aug 17, 2017 10:52 am

Re: Politics

Postby PSUgrower » Wed Jan 09, 2019 11:15 am

So, Manafort meets Russian interest in Spain to share polling data in 2016. Somehow Russia meddles in our election to get Dump elected. There is nothing to see here!!

When Dump gives his State of the Union Address, can the democrats yell, "Lock him up!" That would be funny!

Blue&White
Posts: 3199
Joined: Sat Aug 12, 2017 10:01 am

Re: Politics

Postby Blue&White » Wed Jan 09, 2019 12:00 pm

Hopefully the SOU is as quick as last night's speech. I went against my better judgement and watched it, as well as the rebuttal. Man, Trump looks awful. I mean, he looks horrid. His face was puffy, his eyes were swollen, and he looks like he's put weight on, and he was not thin to begin with. But, 2 years have really taken their toll.

Pelosi looks like a melted barbi doll. Something is really freaky with her. It was a bit unnerving, actually. But, she just looked plastic. Trump looked beaten.
Is it baseball season yet?

Blue&White
Posts: 3199
Joined: Sat Aug 12, 2017 10:01 am

Re: Politics

Postby Blue&White » Thu Jan 10, 2019 3:32 pm

Trump is now claiming he never said that Mexico was going to directly pay for the wall. Of course he never meant that they were going to write check for it. And, he certainly never said they would make a one time payment or anything. You know what would be really embarassing? If during his campaign he had actually put out steps as to how he was going to get Mexico to make that one-time payment. Man, he sure dodged a bullet there.
Is it baseball season yet?

sameoldlama
Posts: 782
Joined: Wed Aug 16, 2017 7:43 am

Re: Politics

Postby sameoldlama » Thu Jan 10, 2019 8:05 pm

Well I guess he's just trying to fit in with the mainstream politicians like the former POTUSes and Chucky, Hillary, Biden, Boxer, Feinstein - all wall opponents of whom there is ample recent video of them calling for increased border security including physical barriers , increased patrols and a crackdown on illegal immigration. I mean it's not like they enacted legislation and voted for a Secure Fence at our southern border.

I'm not in favor of a wall, I think they way to reduce illegal immigration is to disincentivize it by cracking down on companies that hire illegal workers, not extending social benefits to illegals and making the expatriation on money more difficult for illegals. I have heard border patrol union reps and leaders repeatedly call for expansion of physical barriers as an effective means of securing border - that should count for something

I would liken the issue of border security to that of healthcare for Obama. I didn't agree with the Obama's position on socialized healthcare but he was right to pursue it - that's what he campaigned on and that's why his supporters voted for him. Border security was a cornerstone of DT's campaign and he should vigorously pursue it.

The case for improved border security exists - you have a nearly a mid sized city illegally pouring into your country monthly. That presents safety (crime, health) issues and strains your ability to extend social benefits to legal citizens. It's not a viable and sustainable long term situation. I think DT is right to stand his ground - Nancy & Chuck's declaration the budget and wall funding debates should be separated is the most disingenuous ploy ever - if he approved a budget they'd laugh if he came back and asked for any additional border wall funding. That's what's been going in DC for years - any time there is a difficult issue everyone postures, they push it off and the issue gets worse.

Strategically I think DT should say "you've left me no choice but to seek more security at the border because of your sanctuary policies - revoke all your sanctuary policies and cooperate with ICE and we will end shutdown and table wall funding for now". His neck is out - get the Dems on record as saying we don't care how much heroin comes in, how many felons we turn loose or many municipalities get bankrupted - we'd rather that happen than give into you on anything. Get them to stick there necks out.

How best to solve our illegal immigration is a worthy debate - the Democrats are basically calling for open borders - and that would as disasterous here as it has been for Europe.
Wendall : That's very linear Sheriff
Ed Tom : Age will flatten a man Wendall