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It is not at all controversial to tell people to take steps to protect themselves in all other situations, so why is it a problem to tell women to use caution?
Blue&White wrote:i agree with appoo. Women should be able to do all those things. Absolutely. And, if something happens, its' not their fault and they should not be blamed. I'm with that idea 100%.
I think the problem is that, regardless of who is to blame, things do happen. I should be able to leave my car in a parking lot with the windows down, the doors unlocked and the key in the ignition. It's my car and the fact that I made it accessible doesn't mean someone has the right to take it. But, I don't leave my car in that condition in a parking lot because I know that, if I do, there is a good chance the car will be gone when I come back. The fact that the person who took my car committed a crime and could face consequences, including possible jail time, doesn't change the fact that my car is gone.
appoo - of course women should be able to do those things. However, suggesting maybe they take steps to avoid those situations is not the same as blaiming the victims. The point Southern was making, and I agree with him, that regardless of who's fault it is, you should take steps to protect yourself and avoid these situations. We do that in every other walk of life. We lock our cars, we lock our houses, we stay away from certain neighborhoods, we don't leave our credit cards lying around, we protect our passwords, etc. It is not at all controversial to tell people to take steps to protect themselves in all other situations, so why is it a problem to tell women to use caution? Again, the fact that they shouldn't be assaulted regardless is a moot point if they are.
Consider the Winston case at F$U. Let's pretend he wasn't a football player and was just ordinary Joe Schmoe (let's also pretend he was white because a black male accused of rape by a white woman has its own dynamic and no point in getting into that here). So, she goes back to his place, they have sex, and she goes to the police and says she said "no" and he forced himself on her and, rather than sweep it under the rug, they actually investigate it. Ok now what? What do you think happens next? Is he prosecuted? Maybe he is. Is he convicted? I'd guess probably not. A drunk girl who willingly goes back to a guys room and then later claims she was raped is going to have a really tough time convincing a jury to put that guy in jail. Especially if they were both drinking. If she can show he slipped her something, then sure. But, if they both were drinking and she walked back to his place? Good luck with that.
That doesn't mean she wasn't raped. That doesn't mean she was to blame. That doesn't mean it should have happened, or it is ok. And, even if he is convicted, and he goes to jail - it doesn't change what happened to her.
appoo wrote:My point is that there needs to be a sea change. Will doesn't seem to believe that, and there seems to be many who believe that rather than a sea change they'd rather just tell girls to not put themselves in a position where they won't get assaulted, or train themselves in self defense, and declare mission accomplished.
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